Here is a look at KSL’s Development Plan For Squaw Valley

You can view the full plans here – Squaw Valley’s Development Plan

Please feel free to share your thoughts on the development plan below in the comments. 

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95 Comments

  1. Please note there is a Squaw Valley MAC meeting tonight at 6pm, where the proposed village development will be discussed.

    Reply
  2. Squw since 1988 says:

    Who is ready to Vail this place up!

    Reply
  3. Anonymous says:

    Wait, so their is it’s ALL going to be time shares?

    How odes that make any sense?

    Reply
  4. cry baby says:

    where is the casino?

    Reply
  5. Vail Valley on the way! says:

    OMG a mother F’en Ice rink!!!!!!! No way, that is so original.
    KSL must have team of imaginers working on this development around the clock

    Reply
  6. getsteezy says:

    This is totally going to take away from the local vibe squaw has. it will lose its sense of community and become a giant theme park. This is just going to add onto the curse of ksl. squaw is only going to go downhill for the people who appreciate it right now.

    Reply
  7. Bananamanckaes says:

    Sweet, now we get to park super far away. And what about the cantina?

    Reply
  8. jo says:

    yup squaw is getting f’ed up now

    Reply
  9. jo says:

    next thing you now they will be putting boundaries up all year on all the cliffs even after pow dumps. KT-22 is gonna be like heavenly.

    Reply
  10. coyo says:

    bollocks :(

    Reply
  11. Anonymous says:

    No with this plan locals don’t get to park. It will become privite to those people who buy times shares or have stock in ksl.

    Reply
  12. Miles Clark says:

    KSL is the reason I no longer want to be a Squaw Valley Ski Team member.

    Reply
    • Hmmmmm says:

      Miles, first you have to be a member of that team to be able to reject them… And just to clarify, the Squaw Valley Ski Team is the dominant race program in the nation, I think Miles is refereeing to the freeride team.

      Reply
  13. miqual says:

    bring on the foie gras facials and heated Evian bides in the bathroom … now that’s what skiings all about right!

    Reply
  14. no me gusta says:

    hey “Read the Plans” is that you Andy? Take a hint – WE DON’T WANT THIS SHIT! so long tahoe I used to know and love, welcome to Vail West….

    Reply
  15. Anonymous says:

    They can’t get the water

    Reply
    • Squallykook says:

      it’s true. it’s all about the water. this can’t happen unless they find more water.

      Reply
      • Son of Ludwig says:

        KSL is going to have to fork out dough to every single resident of the valley to get approval on this. I see it as a non starter.

        Reply
  16. sacklunch says:

    KSL is so full of crap, it will take them 50+ years to complete this plan. Look at all the other “development” in Tahoe. SLT=the big hole, Homewood=didn’t happen, KB=total shit-hole still, Northstar/Tahoe Mtn. Club=smoke/mirrors and cutbacks. All of these plans either flailed immediately or are crapping the bed now. Just like the rest it will be total hype with a total collapse, jerking around dedicated Squaw riders along the way. Resist KSL all the way, and it may be a good idea to target their investors and stock holders to illustrate what a perpetually bad idea this has been through ski history. These guys are totally lost and out of their element. Go back to the golf course, kooks.

    Reply
  17. snowmonster says:

    Call it a hunch, but even if there is day parking, something tells me we are going to have to pay for it!!!!

    Reply
  18. Sean says:

    Relax, the mountain will remain just as steep as it ever was.

    Reply
    • Andy H says:

      A good point, but what does it mean?

      Really what KSL is doing is putting the mountain in a fancier box. Kind of like giving someone a cheap present in a Tiffany’s box. Despite the fancy packaging it does not change the fact the the object inside remains unchanged. So how does this improve the experience/economics of the mountain. Despite all efforts to hide the point, most people who take ski vacations actually take them to ski. You can tie a bow around it but the terrain will always be the same.

      You can look at this and say the mountain will still be our mountain we love, but you can also say, what’s the frickin’ point. More hotel rooms, more amentities doesn’t change the fact that some people would rather just ski easier terrain, which is not going to be built.

      Reply
  19. tahoe-ggirl says:

    Gee….a water park in a valley that DOES NOT have its own water source! Truckee, watch out, they’ll drain our aquifers – write to Placer County and tell them no water park unless the water comes out of Placer, not Truckee!

    Reply
  20. skisquaw says:

    after all this is done you aren’t even going to be able to see the mountain as you drive into Squaw because of the ten story hotels and condos that nobody will buy. Look at what happened to Northstar, they put a ritz in and nobody bought into it now they are left with a giant ass hotel thats bankrupt sitting in the middle of their fucking mountain. People love squaw because of the terrain, and the people who ski there 80 percent of the time are the locals who dont give a shit about condos and god damn acuatic centers.

    Reply
    • The Faster I Was says:

      KSL really doesn’t care if you can see Squaw. Phase 6 calls for leveling Squaw so they can build more hotels. Their lawyers will be in favor of this, eliminating the risk of those pesky avalanches. Then, something in the future, vistors will wonder why a mountain resort was ever built where there isn’t a mountain.

      Reply
  21. duder says:

    Perhaps KSL is channeling Field of Dreams. If you build it will they actually come? Any one who walks around the village with any regularity will notice that the lights in the private residences are almost never on, even mid winter. Not to mention all the commericial space that does hardly any business. KSL is going to build a monstrosity then bail, leaving locals in the lurch.

    Reply
    • Anonymous says:

      Pump it and dump it, it’s been happening at ski towns across the country. Buy, add assets, emphasize their potential value to a potential seller, and cash out.

      It doesn’t matter that the market isn’t there, they sell on speculation.

      Reply
  22. BoGnar says:

    The pool should be moved more to the left and have a 5buck coffee shop put in it

    Reply
  23. If we went camping... says:

    What are the plans for the mountain ?

    Reply
  24. Anonymous says:

    Slide 17…a Lamborghini and a Hummer. They are clearly in touch with reality.

    Reply
  25. turbodump says:

    all these questions about what’s going to happen with kirkwood and now squaw has me thinking, screw em all. I’ll just ski the backcountry more.

    Reply
  26. Kings all day says:

    Cool man bring da bitchezzzz

    Reply
  27. Observer says:

    A couple thoughts:

    -Don’t understand aquatic thing at all. Kind of seems ridiculous.
    -Their proposed buildings would appear to be approximately twice that of the existing village structures. Think about that for a moment. Preeeetty, preeeetty tall, as Larry David might say.
    -what is the parking plan? I see two structured parking facilities. Where do they expect all the day skiers to park? This would appear to be grossly inadequate and doesn’t seem to address reality?
    -do they plan to build workforce housing? They should if they’re requesting additional density beyond their existing zoning. I have to assume they want additional density.

    If people actually want to do something and have a place at table the best way to do so is probablly and unfortunately through a good land use attorney.

    Reply
  28. KC says:

    Why is all the development such a bad thing? It seems there could be as many positive outcomes from a redevelopment project as there are negative. It seems like it could really help local businesses, improve local infrastructure, and ultimately stimulate the economy. It could even set up the North Tahoe region as a viable location for another Olympics.

    Squaw has always had attitude and been the resort of tourists and the bay area, so to those saying that THIS is going to ruin the ‘squaw’ vibe, I don’t agree with your premises. In the 90′s Squaw had the most unfriendly staff and the snobbiest crowds to ski there, ever since I can remember Alpine was the ‘local’s skiers mountain’ and Squaw for for the yuppies. But skiers, borders, locals, and tourists put that aside and never cared about the attitude because it is an amazing mountain, the terrain and amount of area is unbeatable for the area.

    Without getting into ski area economics, like anything it costs money to run a business, to keep the lifts operating, and the parking lot plowed. When your competing for markets with the likes of Vail, Whistler, Mammoth, and Park City as top ski destination it only makes sense to continue to run a successful business you keep up with competitors. Growing up in the area I understand the desire to keep the area small, local, and organic but that doesn’t mean all development and growth is bad and it definitely doesn’t mean that it isn’t needed.

    Let’s face it, small businesses in Tahoe and Truckee struggle (possibly more than small businesses in other areas) making money in a market laden with competition and impacted so greatly by weather and other uncontrollable circumstances. Traffic on Highway 89 is horrible, the 15 minutes it takes to get from Truckee to Squaw can take two or more hours on any given weekend in January or February. Placer County, the City of Truckee, and Tahoe City only have a general fund so big to implement the massive scale construction project it would be to widen highway 89. Not to mention the public controversy it would cause, the environmental permitting and impacts it would trigger and technical constraints of engineering a road in a narrow river canyon that is subject to flooding.

    Having KSL or any other developer bring in a project of this magnitude would result (with public involvement) in improvements to all these infrastructure areas that need improvement and would be paid for by the developer and investors as opposed to the local community.

    I’m not endorsing this project or that development of this magnitude is the right path for the area. But before complaining, try to think of all the ramifications and potential benefits. If you feel that passionately, attend planning meetings, get involved at the town council, and give your input in a constructive way. It may result in a better community with lots of cool resources.

    Cheers and let’s hope for lots of snow!

    Reply
    • KC says:

      I’m borrowing this from a comment on the ‘Once A Skier’s Mountain | Changing Times for Squaw Valley and the Tahoe Basin’ (http://unofficialnetworks.com/skiers-mountain-changing-times-squaw-valley-tahoe-basin-110411/) article.

      As the commenter states the Comment period closes NOVEMBER 9th for the environmental review process. SO get out there and voice your opinions where it counts! Get involved, work for the betterment of the community and the area.
      Just like to point out that none of these plans are approved nor even analyzed for environmental impacts yet. Rather than complaining on a website, go read the Notice of Preparation and Initial Study Checklist for the project here: http://www.placer.ca.gov/Departments/CommunityDevelopment/EnvCoordSvcs/EIR/VSVSP.aspx

      KSL has many obstacles to overcome before anything can happen. As of now, the initial study shows significant adverse effects to every section of the checklist including viewsheds, water quality, air quality, biological resources, aesthetics and many more. By California Environmental Quality Act (CEQA) regulations, this project now faces the production of an Environmental Impact Report (EIR) for each checklist item that found significant impact. The project CANNOT be approved (per california law) if these impacts cannot be mitigated. The EIR will assess whether mitigation is possible. There is still plenty of possibility that this project will not be approved by Placer County. The comment period on the above documents is open until November 9th, 2012. Comments can be directed here: http://www.placer.ca.gov/Departments/CommunityDevelopment/Planning/TahoePlanning/VillageAtSquawValleySpecificPlan/ContactUs.aspx

      If you want to affect this outcome, get involved, submit a comment. Also, the project faces numerous public input opportunities with Placer County and Squaw Valley MAC, go to the meetings and make your voice heard!! I am fairly certain this project will not get approved with the current plan, but the more input and opposition KSL faces, the harder it will be for this to happen! For more information:

      http://www.placer.ca.gov/Departments/CommunityDevelopment/EnvCoordSvcs/EIR/VSVSP.aspx

      And as a side note, those of us that are younger community members and plan to stick around the Tahoe area will see the longest lasting impacts from these development plans. Therefore, we (I’m 24 years old) should be highly involved in these planning processes if we want to control what our community will look like when we are homeowners, parents, and/or long term residents in the future. At the meeting this morning to review the Notice of Preparation and Initial Study there were over 50 people in attendance. I would estimate about 10 people were under the age of 40. WE NEED TO GET INVOLVED. The author of this article should’ve given links to get involved rather than just complaining.
      http://www.placer.ca.gov/Departments/CommunityDevelopment/Planning/TahoePlanning/VillageAtSquawValleySpecificPlan/ContactUs.aspx

      Reply
    • Garry S. says:

      Look, I don’t live in the Tahoe area…used to visit growing up. Yes, I was one of the weekend warriors who learned to ski there, stayed for a bit, and spent MONEY over 15 years on things like actually skiing, hiking, fishing, etc. We didn’t go for the golf, or roller coasters, or water slides, or ice skating or swimming at high camp. Those are gimmicks that don’t bring in lasting money.

      I get it, in a vacation based economy you need to get people to visit to spend money. Tahoe is located 3 hours from a huge metropolitan area. You essentially have a captive audience. I have since lived in other vacation towns and I currently live in one. But people who generally manage destination resorts like Squaw target wealthy, non-active Americans. Which seems to miss the point that there are ton of wealthy, active, outdoors oriented Americans. Theme park developments drive that market AWAY, not to the resort.

      How about a development that restores some of the stream, incorporates trails around the valley floor, and encourages more hiking and mountain use in the summer? Couple it with actual SUSTAINABLE, well designed development, and encourage long-term stable growth and return visitors. Yes, roller coasters and water parks might attract some people and will create a big news splash, but is that really the market demographic you want? In addition, all these large capital expenditures require a ton of money to maintain and operate. Meanwhile, you have a free attraction resource (the outdoors) right out your back door. My idea is do a better job of marketing what you have, don’t try to create something that won’t work in the long run.

      Reply
    • Ski Bum says:

      Holy Smokes! Someone that is articulate and has a brain!

      Reply
    • sman says:

      DUDE TOO LONG

      Reply
  29. yo says:

    Doesn’t surprise me. At least I don’t see any plans to develop Alpine. Damn I love Alpine. Don’t really care for Squaw, especially on weekend powder days. F that.

    Reply
  30. DirtySanchez says:

    booting up in a parking garage seems to be missing the point of true skiing….. no exposed winter elements? no view of the mountain? no clearing a small patch of ground to step into your frozen boots? no open air stoke across the whole lot? and the stairs, oh the stairs……wait, there will probably be elevators.

    Reply
  31. Peter says:

    Why does good old squaw have to become a fucking vail?

    Reply
  32. Andy H says:

    Simply put, what makes this work when the existing village has been such a failure?

    The village has been empty for years (businesses and residences), untill KSL artificially filled it up with their own shops. What else do they have to offer? When in doubt double it’s size? Sure it will increase the sale price when they bail but where does that leave the people who actually live here?

    Reply
  33. Andy H says:

    What needs to be remembered is that Tahoe is a unique area. KSL sees that other major resorts have these villages, they have no imagination, and no idea what they are doing in the industry and say “we need one of those.”

    This isn’t Tremblant. This isn’t Whistler. This isn’t a single mountain in the middle of no where. This isn’t the place you come on a vacation and stay in village park your car at the begining of the week and leave it there untill you want to go home. Tahoe is a region that boasts several major resorts. You come here to see the lake, to visit Tahoe City and Truckee, to take in the whole experience. If you don’t you are selling yourself and your vacation short.

    Villages like this work if there is nothing else to do but stay and eat and shop at the resort, but in a place like this there are multiple opportunities at multiple locations. KSL may want to make this an all inclusive resort but it is just being blind to the realities of the market.

    Reply
  34. Was interesting to flip through the powerpoint this morning. For a 100 acre development proposal this doesn’t seem to be particularly comprehensive. I see a lot of early stage ideas (let’s have fake rapids and a water slide for the kids!)

    1300 rooms seems way small for 101 acres, especially with the height of the buildings they are proposing, They’ve got a ton of land blocked off. Seems like one of those proposals where if the Placer quartered the request KSL is still in a good position to expand.

    So far I like what Andy’s done. I’m giving KSL the benefit of the doubt. If you judged everything by it’s early powerpoints you’d probably be sorry, of course I wouldn’t mind seeing the Squaw connecting lifts down to Homewood over the next 20 years, and I think you have to have a little of what’s here to get to that. Not everybody loves either part of that vision.

    Reply
  35. Was a 20 year squaw employee says:

    The plan is not that far off of what Squaw had planned ($10 valley entry, walk conveyor to shuttle people from the underground parking- only 1 of 3 phases had been completed before the crash of $$$) before KSL came in and started crushing the local vibe. Some house cleaning was needed yes, but the good employee core should have been kept. Then to be replaced with Northstar employees. ? Huuuum. Northstar big skier count maybe 5000. Squaw 10,000.+ Did you see how small they made the ticket portal. Yea Northstar is what you needed haha. Maybe you should have looked deeper in the people who had worked and seen squaw for the past 20+ years. One more thing- did you forget to look at the font on that awful background, if you can. Come on mr web guy

    Reply
  36. tpinwv says:

    Sad proposal. For me, I lost intrest in Squaw when the parking lot village went in. I supported the area with sweat equity for over a decade in return for the best experience in the Sierra for skiing. When the Village went in and redundent businesses came in and local businesses were kicked out, I lost faith and quit buying into the hype. This pig-plan is over-loaded yes as KSL realize they might get 40% of it actually approved and built. Stop the nonsense, unless the resort can add an additional 3,000+ skiable acres, where do you propose putting everybody on the hill? Before the village and volume pass-pricing strategies, one could put up with a 18,000 weekend-holiday volume, knowing it would be back to 3,000 midweek right afterwards. There isn’t enough water for snowmking to handle the continuous volume this plan would bring to the resort. It would be great to go see an emphasis on developing the mountain(s) for additional acerage before any other push is started to increase the valley into something out of proportion with the deliverables.

    Reply
    • Andy H says:

      But if it’s too crowded to ski what else is left???

      That’s right, shopping!!!

      People enjoying themselves on the hill cuts into the business in the village.
      I think their business strategey is pretty sound.
      Skiing only eats into the profits….
      in fact let’s just shut the mountain down and open a mall.

      Reply
  37. YeeKiller says:

    Better enjoy a year or two more of good ole Squaw, before it is gone. I personally plan and getting 100+ days this year at squaw alone. This is why I skateboard. the MAN can never attach itself to skateboarding.

    Reply
  38. YeeKiller says:

    If skiing squaw is the only way for you to get radical, I feel sorry for you.

    Reply
  39. in zee middle says:

    no matter what they do I will always keep making squaw my main mtn. addicted, plain and simple.

    Reply
  40. sman says:

    JUST GONNA BRING MORE GAPERS AND A LONGWER LINE AT KT ON POW DAYS.

    SOUNDS LIKE VAIL……… THEM LINES FOR CHAIRS ARE INSANE.

    DOESNT MATTER. EARN YOUR TURNS.
    THEN YOUR NOT EFFFECTED…. SHOULD THAT BEEN SPELLED WITH AN a?

    Reply
  41. Lift lines are awesome says:

    BAAAAHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA! #1

    Reply
  42. Ahhhhh! says:

    Fuck Andy and all his clowns!

    Reply
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